6.Kenneth Olson — Direct/Cross/Redirect
256 linesMR. FALLON: Yes. State would call Kenneth Olson.
THE COURT: Is it your plan that Mr. Olson will be your last witness this afternoon?
MR. FALLON: Yes.
COURT CLERK: Raise your right hand, please.
KENNETH OLSON, called as a witness herein, having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
COURT CLERK: Be seated. State your name and spell your last name for the record, please?
KENNETH OLSON: Kenneth B. Olson, O-1-S-o-n.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY ATTORNEY FALLON:
MR. FALLON: How are you employed?
KENNETH OLSON: I'm a forensic scientist at the State Crime Laboratory in Madison.
MR. FALLON: And how long, um, have you been employed in that cap -- uh, in that capacity?
KENNETH OLSON: Approximately 27 years.
MR. FALLON: What type of, uh, forensic science do-you practice at the Crime Lab?
KENNETH OLSON: My main duties at the Crime Laboratory is in the area of trace evidence examination. I examine a variety of materials; paint, glass, fibers, plastics, metals, um, anything that needs chemical identification or comparison, um, that doesn't fit into drugs, toxicology, or DNA.
MR. FALLON: All right. And how long have you been actively engaged in the trace evidence, uh, field?
KENNETH OLSON: My -- The whole time that I've been employed at the laboratory.
MR. FALLON: All right. Have you ever been a member of -- for instance, of, uh, the Field Response Unit for the Crime Lab?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes. I was an active member of our field response program for 24 years.
MR. FALLON: All right. Um, are you a current member?
KENNETH OLSON: I kind of fill in as needed.
MR. FALLON: All right. How is it that you became involved in this particular case?
KENNETH OLSON: I was asked to examine, um, several items that were recovered during the investigation of this case. Um, items from a burning barrel, uh, and some, uh, charred bones.
MR. FALLON: All right. Um, and, in particular, your reason for being here today is to provide us the, uh, results of your examinations?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FALLON: All right. Um, before we do so, um, I'd like to find out a little bit about your, um -- your background. I'm going to have Exhibit, um, 136, uh, given to you by Investigator Wiegert. Do you recognize Exhibit 136?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I do.
MR. FALLON: What is Exhibit 136?
KENNETH OLSON: Exhibit 136 is a statement of my qualifications.
MR. FALLON: And, uh, did you prepare that exhibit?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I did.
MR. FALLON: All right. Well, first of all, let's talk about your, uh, educational, um, experience. First of all, do you have an undergraduate degree?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I do.
MR. FALLON: And from which institution?
KENNETH OLSON: I have a Bachelor of Science Degree from the University of Wisconsin at Superior with a major in chemistry.
MR. FALLON: All right. Uh, have you received any, uh, post, um, uh, graduate experience at all in -- or courses of that ilk?
KENNETH OLSON: I took a couple, um, um, Master's of Business Administration courses.
MR. FALLON: Very good. And what particular, uh, on-the-job-training have you received to assist you in performing the tests that you, uh, currently perform for the Crime Lab?
KENNETH OLSON: Since being employed at the Crime Laboratory in the area of trace evidence, I did a three-year apprenticeship-type activity, learning the different aspects of trace evidence. So I had extensive on-the-job-training, and the laboratory sent me to several schools over those training years in all the different areas that I do analysis, um, with the different types of instruments that we use to the different types of evidence that we handle.
MR. FALLON: All right. Um, are there any particular, um, associations or organizations that you belong to, either for training purposes or for professional development?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes. Relating to forensic science, I'm a member of the Midwest Association of Forensic Scientists. I'm also a member of the Association for Crime Scene Reconstruction, and a member of the International Association of Blood Stain Pattern Analysts.
MR. FALLON: All right. And do you regularly a -- attend trainings in these areas of specialization to maintain, uh, current familiarity with the research and the literature and general crime scene processing requirements?
KENNETH OLSON: As often as -- as I can.
MR. FALLON: All right. Um, when did you first become involved in this case? What was your first, um, assigned task?
KENNETH OLSON: The first evidence that I examined in this case, um, I received some items from a burning barrel on December 1, 2005.
MR. FALLON: What kind of items did you examine from a burn barrel?
KENNETH OLSON: The items were submitted in -- in -- I, um, put the materials out on a -- an exam table, and I found, um, items of -- of -- uh, from a cell phone. Um, it was a Motorola -- Motorola cell phone. You could tell that the -- um, just visually, the material -- it was, um, consistent with, uh, a cell phone, flip phone, and I found, um, charred remains of a -- a Canon Sure Shot A310 camera, and then some other electrical components and, uh, some batteries.
MR. FALLON: All right. Um, did you recommend any additional or further forensic work on that material that you, yourself, were unable to, um, uh -- to conduct?
KENNETH OLSON: I was asked if I could get any information from the cell phone or the components of the camera. And I informed the investigators that, um, our laboratory's not equipped to do that type of analysis. Um, I'm basically one that can examine things either visually or microscopically, and give them investigative leads. So if they needed a more in detailed analysis, they would have to send that to, uh,
another laboratory or the FBI.
MR. FALLON: All right. After examining the contents of the, uh -- the burn barrel, what was the next, um, matter, uh, which concerned your, uh, expertise?
KENNETH OLSON: In February of 2006, I was asked to examine some skull fragments, some charred skull fragments from a burning pit. Um, specifically, uh, they wanted me to examine, uh, an entrance, uh, defect into that skull fragment.
MR. FALLON: All right. And describe the skull fragment that you were asked to examine?
KENNETH OLSON: The skull fragment was, um, a small, um, approximately two inches in -- in diameter, um, piece of charred skull that had a hole in it, and that hole had some beveling on the outer surface, and it -- and it had some, um -- some beveling or concave appearance on the inside of the -- the bone fragment.
MR. FALLON: All right. I'm showing investigate -- uh, having Investigator Wiegert show you a photograph. Um, what exhibit number is that, please?
KENNETH OLSON: Exhibit 140 is a photograph of that cranial skull fragment that I examined that had the beveling, um, and the -- can't think of the term -- the concave, uh, nature of the -- of the bone.
MR. FREMGEN: Judge, at this point I don't know if I necessarily have an objection, but I -- I suppose I'd like some more foundation from this witness. He's referring to it as a cranial or a skull fragment. I don't think the expert has -- Well, I don't think he has an expertise to say what type of bone this is other than, someone told me it might have been a cranial bone.
I -- I know he mentioned charred bones when he was talking about what he reviewed, and now it's referred to as cranial bone. If there could be some more foundation as to how he knows what that is.
MR. FALLON: That's where I'm going next.
MR. FREMGEN: Okay.
THE COURT: All right.
MR. FREMGEN: Thank you.
MR. FALLON: (By Attorney Fremgen) Um, from whom did you receive these items for purposes of, uh, analysis?
KENNETH OLSON: These items were, uh, originated from, uh, Dr. Leslie Eisenberg, um, an anthropologist with the State Historical Society.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, did the -- the items that you examined, they did receive a Crime Lab designation; is that correct?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, they did.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, first of all, tell us about the -- the items that were -- how they were originally submitted to you in their packaging? Would you describe that for us, please?
KENNETH OLSON: Could I refer to my notes to that?
MR. FALLON: Sure.
KENNETH OLSON: This particular item in Exhibit 140, uh, was received in a box, um, from DCI, and Item EJ, which is that, um, bone fragment there, um, was received in, uh, three sealed plastic Ziplock bags. Uh, one was labeled cranial refits with suspected entrance deficit. The second one was labeled cranial refits, and the third one was labeled cranial refits. Um, I was only interested in the suspected entrance defect in that one, uh, uh, skull fragment.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, again, um, from whom were those, um, uh, items received?
KENNETH OLSON: EJ and EK were submitted by Special Agents -- Special Agent James Holmes, uh, Division of Criminal Investigation.
MR. FALLON: That's correct. Now, you mentioned something about Dr. Eisenberg? Were there indications or markings on the materials indicating that she had previously examined those items?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes. Those were, um, her markings, her initials.
MR. FALLON: All right. And her labeling?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes.
MR. FALLON: All right. Very well. With respect to, um -- Of the items that you examined, you -- you indicated you only examined one item?
KENNETH OLSON: Of -- of the two that were submitted, Item EJ and A -- uh, EK, I only examined the one, uh, fragment from Item EK. Or EJ, excuse me.
MR. FALLON: All right. And the item -- and the other items were -- how were they labeled?
KENNETH OLSON: The other item was a sealed plastic bag with bone -- bone fragments labeled cranial, slash, face, slash, dental.
MR. FALLON: All right. And was there any indication of a suspected entrance defect on Item EK?
KENNETH OLSON: No, there was not.
MR. FALLON: All right. Let's begin, then, with, um, Item EJ. Specifically, how did you begin your analysis of that item?
KENNETH OLSON: Um, first thing I did was just examine, um, that, uh, skull fragment, uh, under my normal stereo microscope to see what the surfaces looked like, to see if I could see any, um, metallic metal present. Um, I then, um, mounted the item on a -- a scanning electron microscope that uses energy disbursed x-rays to do elemental analysis on the areas, and I was specifically interested in the areas, um, around the -- the entrance defect, both on the -- on the inner surface and on the, um -- on the inward beveling.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, what was the condition of the fragment that you examined?
KENNETH OLSON: It was heavily charred. Um, and it was -- and it was brittle.
MR. FALLON: All right. And did you take any special precautions in handling the matter, um, prior to subjecting it to testing?
KENNETH OLSON: Just, uh, handled with, uh, gloves and was gentle with it.
MR. FALLON: All right. And subsequent to your, um, examination of that item, did you receive other fragments from Dr. Eisenberg, uh, to examine?
KENNETH OLSON: In November, um -- November 17, 2006, um, I received, uh, two other, uh, charred cranial pieces from Dr. Eisenberg.
MR. FALLON: All right. And what were those items designated?
KENNETH OLSON: Those items were designated Item KQ and KR.
MR. FALLON: All right. And describe, um, if you would, uh, Item KQ in a little more detail, would you, please?
KENNETH OLSON: Item KQ was a smaller bone fragment than Item EJ. It also had an entrance defect present. And what, uh, was interesting from Dr. Eisenberg's standpoint, and -- and my standpoint, was the x-rays of that item showed some tiny little bright spots present in the x-ray, which usually means there's some type of dense metal there.
MR. FALLON: All right. I'm going to show you one more photograph, 137. Do you recognize that?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes. Exhibit 137 is the outer surface of Item KQ, uh, showing the entrance defect with the beveled edge.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, you mentioned something also about, um, some x-rays. I'm going to have two more exhibits, uh, provided to you, uh, 138 and 139. Beginning with, uh, 138, do you recognize 138?
KENNETH OLSON: Exhibit 138 appears to be a x-ray image of Item EJ, the, um, first skull fragment that I examined.
MR. FALLON: All right. I'm showing the inner surface. All right? And, uh, now, you mentioned, uh, before, we -- Well, yeah. All right. Let's go to the next one. Exhibit, uh, one thirty --
KENNETH OLSON: Nine?
MR. FALLON: -- nine. And directing your attention to the piece in the upper left-hand corner, uh, of that exhibit, do you recognize that?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I do.
MR. FALLON: All right. And is, um -- What is that?
KENNETH OLSON: Uh, Exhibit 139, uh, is a x-ray image of eight, um, bone fragments. And, specifically, the one in the upper left-hand corner, which has an entrance defect, shows some bright spots right on the edge of that entrance defect, both on the beveled edge, uh, and inside of the beveling.
MR. FALLON: All right. Now, that, um, looks different than Item 137. Um, and if you can explain to us, um, the apparent difference?
KENNETH OLSON: One thirty-seven, um, shows this smaller bone fragment with the entrance defect, um, attached to, uh, some more bone fragments. And that attachment is, uh, done after these x-rays were taken, um, when Dr. Eisenberg was putting together the pieces to try to, um, put the bone fragments back together to what they originally were.
MR. FALLON: Hence, the designation cranial refit?
KENNETH OLSON: Correct.
MR. FALLON: All right. Well, um, let's start, then, with the, um, exhibit, uh, with the, um -- the -- the x-ray of the last one, 138?
KENNETH OLSON: One thirty-nine?
MR. FALLON: Oh, 139, I'm sorry. There we go. All right. Now, directing your attention to the -- the zoomed-in picture of 139, what are we -- If you'd -- I believe there's a laser pointer to, uh -- right next to your material there. And you can either use the large screen over here, or one of those. It might be easier to use the large screen. Um, what are we looking at with the, um -- the area that seems to fluoresce there?
KENNETH OLSON: I was interested in these bright particles here, and focused my scanning electron microscope on those areas.
MR. FALLON: All right. And with respect to those areas, what were you able to, um, determine?
KENNETH OLSON: I. was able to determine what elements were present, um, on that -- on that area that I was examining.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, similarly, I'm going to back up to Exhibit 138 now, the, um, previous one, and ask you, on this particular one, on a zoomed-in, uh, picture of that, there appears to be, likewise, some fluorescing material there?
KENNETH OLSON: There is one bright particle there. Um, I did not have access to this x-ray when I was doing my analysis. So I focused my attention in this area here and this area in here.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, were you able to, uh, make any determination as to what these substances were, uh, along that ridgeline that you've just identified?
KENNETH OLSON: Most of the -- the -- The strongest elements that I found in these areas were calcium and phosphorus, which are the elements of bone. Um, but in the upper area, in this area, I did detect, uh, traces of elemental lead.
MR. FALLON: All right. When we say "traces of elemental lead", what do you mean?
KENNETH OLSON: Like I mentioned, um, the strongest elements that were present in that area were calcium and phosphorus, and those are the -- the main elements of bone. Um, and I would suspect to see them, since I'm looking at a -- a -- a sample of -- of bone.
Um, but I was also interested in seeing if I could detect any lead, um, because this entrance defect interested me from a science standpoint that that was, indeed, a bullet hole, that I would be looking for any traces of lead metal.
MR. FALLON: All right. And how many different locations along that area did you examine?
KENNETH OLSON: I examined three areas in here and found elemental lead. And I examined four areas over here and I did not detect any elemental lead.
MR. FALLON: All right. Did you examine any other, um, aspects of this particular item to determine whether there was any trace of elemental lead elsewhere on the, um, exhibit?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I did.
MR. FALLON: Tell us about that?
KENNETH OLSON: I purposely went to an area away from that entrance defect, uh, to get a background or a control sample of what elements I would suspect or would think to find in that area. And in that area, that control area, a -- away from that entrance defect, I did not detect any presence of elemental lead.
MR. FALLON: So in -- in terms -- As a scientist, having looked at a control area, and now having that knowledge, and comparing it with the area near the defect, what does that suggest to you or what does that tell you?
KENNETH OLSON: That tells me that if I'm seeing lead in that entrance defect, that a source of that could be a bullet.
MR. FALLON: All right. How many control areas did you utilize?
KENNETH OLSON: I believe I took four, uh, control areas away from that entrance defect.
MR. FALLON: All right. Very good. In your experience, um -- Well, let me also ask, have you had any firearms training as part of your, uh, Crime Lab training?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I -- I do.
MR. FALLON: And tell us about that?
KENNETH OLSON: For about a year and two or three months in the year 2000, I did some cross-training in the Firearms Unit, um, examining guns, preparing guns for destruction, um, test firing guns, recovering the bullets, doing bullet comparisons, cartridge case comparisons.
MR. FALLON: All right. Very good. I want to, um, move onto the, um -- Well, before I do, let me ask you this question: With respect to Item EJ, based on your findings of traces of elemental lead, uh, your, uh, Crime Lab training, is -- is that defend -- uh, defect that you observed on that item consistent with having been caused by a high-speed projectile?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, it is.
MR. FALLON: Um, and why is that? What is it about the defect and your findings that, um, lead you to that conclusion?
KENNETH OLSON: From my experience in crime scenes and field response, uh, pending autopsies, and giving training to law enforcement, that when, um, something -- something is shot with a bullet in the skull, you get this type of beveling on the surface from where the bullet impacts, and then you have that concave beveling on the inside surface that, uh, is very, um, characteristic of a high-speed projectile, including bullets.
MR. FALLON: All right. Very good. Let's, um, move onto, um, the item, um, KQ, and I think we have that as Exhibit 139?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FALLON: All right. Again, we're focusing in on the, um, piece of the upper left-hand corner of this exhibit. Tell us about your examination of this particular fragment?
KENNETH OLSON: I did have a photograph of this x-ray when I was doing my analysis of this item, and I focused my analysis in the area here. I took four samples. One here, two, three and four. Um --
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, with respect to those particular four areas, what did you find?
KENNETH OLSON: In areas one and two, the two strongest elements were calcium and phosphorus. Uh, and then the third strongest element in that area was -- was elemental lead. Uh, Item -- areas three and four, the strongest, um, element present was lead on those two areas.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, likewise, uh, comparatively speaking, was there more or less lead associated with, um, Item KQ, Exhibit 139, than with Item EJ, Exhibit 137?
KENNETH OLSON: There was considerably more lead in this particular bone fragment, KQ, than there was in Item EJ.
MR. FALLON: Um, likewise, with respect to this particular item, did -- did you test other areas of the fragment? In other words, did you develop control areas from which to make comparisons?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I did.
MR. FALLON: Tell us about that?
KENNETH OLSON: Like in the previous item, I went to an area away from the defect and, um, did not detect any lead present in tho -- in those areas.
MR. FALLON: All right. And so what did that tell you or signify to you relative to your findings of, uh, lead in -- in -- in and around the area perceived to be the defect?
KENNETH OLSON: That finding lead in the area of this entrance defect, associated with bright spots that are consistent with very dense metal that -- that -- containing mainly lead, that it could have come from a bullet.
MR. FALLON: All right. Is the, um -- on microscopic examination, is that defect area, which you identified as having traces of lead present, or -- or be more than traces of el -- actual elemental lead present -- is that consistent with, um, a -- a -- a defect caused by a> high-speed projectile?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, it is.
MR. FALLON: All right. And why is that?
KENNETH OLSON: As I mentioned earlier, that type of defect, um, striking hard bone, causes the beveling effects on the out -- outside and on the inside surfaces that is consistent with a high-speed projectile, such as a bullet.
MR. FALLON: On this -- On this particular item, did you do both the inside and the outside?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I did.
MR. FALLON: First of all, so we're all clear, what do you mean inside and outside? Are we referring to the defect beveled area? Or what are we referring to?
KENNETH OLSON: I'm referring to the in -- inner surface of the skull versus the outer surface. What we're -- What we see in this exhibit, this is the inner surface here. So this is the inner beveling of that defect. And I did look at the other side, the, um, outside surface.
MR. FALLON: All right. And with respect to the outer -- the other outside area, what did you find relative to the presence or absence of lead?
KENNETH OLSON: In the area inside of that bevel, I was able to detect elemental lead on the -- the beveling on the outside surface.
MR. FALLON: All right. Similarly, did you employ that same control technique on this, um -- outside, as you did on the inside area?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I did.
MR. FALLON: All right. And what did that, if anything, indicate to you?
KENNETH OLSON: I did not defect any lead, uh, in my control area.
MR. FALLON: Is it fair to say, then, that the only traces, or presence, actually, of lead were in and around the area identified as this defect?
KENNETH OLSON: From what I examined, yes.
MR. FALLON: All right. All right. Mr. Olson, the opinion that, um, Item EJ, the first one we examined,. had traces of elemental lead, uh, associated with it, do you hold that opinion to a reasonable degree of scientific certainty?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I do.
MR. FALLON: Um, with respect to the item given Crime Lab designation KQ, uh, do you hold the opinion to a reasonable degree of scientific certainty that Item KQ, uh, contained elemental lead in and around that defect area?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I do.
MR. FALLON: Subject to the receipt of the four exhibits, one -- Or, excuse me, five. The, uh, CV, 136 through 140, we, uh, move those into evidence, and tender the witness for cross-examination.
THE COURT: Yeah. My sheet shows that, uh, 132 through 135 had not yet been offered.
MR. FALLON: Oh. Well, then I would make a motion that they be received as well.
THE COURT: Any objection, gentlemen, to either of those motions?
MR. FREMGEN: Judge, we reserve -- Ask -- ask the Court to reserve ruling on those at this time. I wish to be heard on a few of those.
THE COURT: All right. Cross.
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY ATTORNEY FREMGEN:
MR. FREMGEN: Doctor, I -- I noticed -- And you did ask, uh, Attorney Fallon if you could refer to your notes. Um, I understand it's been about 12 or 15 months since you evaluated these items? Completed --
KENNETH OLSON: I --
MR. FREMGEN: -- your reports?
KENNETH OLSON: I evaluated in December of '05, February of '06, April of '06, and November of '06.
MR. FREMGEN: So it would be difficult for you, from the top of your head, to know everything that you wrote in your reports, or recall everything you wrote in your reports?
KENNETH OLSON: Well, I tried to prepare today to be able to not refer to them, but some of the specific questions I asked to review my notes.
MR. FREMGEN: And that's fine. You, um, had indicated -- And, actually, I only have a few questions for you. So, hopefully, we'll make it easier for you. You'd indicated that when you reviewed, uh -- when you tested the areas of -- on EJ, I think in your notes you refer to them as -- there's one, two, three, and four, five, six? That's the outer edges of that bevel area?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: That you noted the -- the presence of calcium and phosphorus? Which you've testified is consistent with bone?
KENNETH OLSON: Correct.
MR. FREMGEN: And lead? Which wouldn't normally be -- be consistent with a human bone?
KENNETH OLSON: I'm not aware of finding that large a concentrations in human bone.
MR. FREMGEN: There's small concentrations of lead in the human body, but not in bone like that; correct?
KENNETH OLSON: Not that I'm able to detect.
MR. FREMGEN: Now -- And -- and your assumption is that it might be from some sort of a lead projectile? In fact, you said bullet?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes.
MR. FREMGEN: Um, are you aware of what items were in the fire pit, or in this -- where -- where -- this burning pit, that might have maybe contributed to the lead presence?
KENNETH OLSON: I knew there were tires. That's about the limit of my knowledge.
MR. FREMGEN: Okay. Could -- could -- Well, it -- could have something in the fire, had it been lead, contributed to these deposits?
KENNETH OLSON: It's possible, but it would have to be a relatively pure sample.
MR. FREMGEN: Did you note any copper in any of these -- in your evaluation?
KENNETH OLSON: No, I did not.
MR. FREMGEN: You did note other elements? Including zinc, magnesium, aluminum?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: So, uh, just to be correct, on -- on your direct, it wasn't just calcium, phosphorus, and lead, but at least three or four more other elements?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: And would that be normal to find in the human bone?
KENNETH OLSON: I have limited, um, um, opportunities to examine bone fragments, but on the samples that I did examine, I was not surprised with the elements I was seeing there.
MR. FREMGEN: When you also, uh, did your control samples, similar type of elements would show up?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes.
MR. FREMGEN: And, again, not a surprise to you?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: Your control was only on one other area of the bone fragments you -- provided to you?
KENNETH OLSON: Every surface that I examined, um, like if it was the inner surface of one of the bones, I would do a control on the inner surface. If I examined the -- the entrance on the outer surface, I would do a control on that same outer surface.
MR. FREMGEN: And you did that for every fragment that you received?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I did.
MR. FREMGEN: You also received a -- a headboard?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes, I did.
MR. FREMGEN: And -- and you had an opportunity to examine it to determine if there were any rope fibers; correct?
KENNETH OLSON: That's what I was requested to examine, to see if I could find any rope fibers attached to the headboard.
MR. FREMGEN: So you're directed to look for this?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: And you did, uh, an actual -- a visual examination; correct?
KENNETH OLSON: Visual with some microscopic exam.
MR. FREMGEN: So the first step would be to visually observe the item?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: And when you visually observed the item, you noted no rope fibers; correct?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: Uh, and then, of course, the microscopic evaluation would be because our eyes aren't that great; right?
KENNETH OLSON: A magnification helps in the area of trace evidence.
MR. FREMGEN: And, obviously, that's your training? And you know that the next step would be to try to take a closer look; correct?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: And in order to do so, you used some sort of an adhesive tape to -- to pull up what might be on the surface of that, uh, wooden spindle on the headboard?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes.
MR. FREMGEN: That's one -- one technique for looking for fibers is by using a tape lift to take a, um -- not too strong of an adhesive, um, but just to tape lift, like a lint remover type lift, and then examine what fibers were recovered from that? You don't want to pull off the surface, itself?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: And so with that, you were able to then, uh, place it onto some -- uh, some sort of a slide?
KENNETH OLSON: Actually, I placed it on a plastic backing, and then I can examine that under the microscope, and if I see something of interest, I can put a little cut in that plastic and, with a solvent, remove all the fibers I'm interested in.
MR. FREMGEN: Did you note any fibers?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes.
MR. FREMGEN: Were they rope fibers?
KENNETH OLSON: Uh, they were not consistent with rope fibers.
MR. FREMGEN: You noted some cotton fibers?
KENNETH OLSON: That's correct.
MR. FREMGEN: Okay. I have nothing else. Thank you, Doctor.
THE COURT: Any redirect?
MR. FALLON: Yes.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY ATTORNEY FALLON:
MR. FALLON: Was it, um -- Is it, uh, expected or unusual for you not to find any rope fibers given the -- the material you examined?
KENNETH OLSON: In my experience, um, smooth surfaces, like spindles on a headboard, are not your best surface for snagging fibers. Um, if there was, uh, slivers, a nail, or something that could snag, uh, rope fibers, that would be a better method for depositing fibers, um, on a surface.
MR. FALLON: All right. Now, did you find something -- anything else on that -- that headboard?
KENNETH OLSON: Yes. On one of the spindles there was a thin, plastic film that I removed and analyzed, and identified it as polypropylene.
MR. FALLON: What are some of the uses of polypropylene is?
KENNETH OLSON: Um, polypropylene, um, is used in garments, it's used, um, uh, as plastic containers, um, it -- it is also used in rope manufacturing.
MR. FALLON: No further questions.
MR. FREMGEN: No, Judge.
THE COURT: All right. You may step down.
KENNETH OLSON: Thank you, Your Honor.
THE COURT: You're welcome. Any further witnesses this afternoon?
MR. FALLON: We do not have any this afternoon, Judge. We went a little more quickly than anticipated.
THE COURT: All right. Uh, Mr. Fremgen, you want to be heard on some of these exhibits? I'll excuse the jury for the afternoon and we can talk about the exhibits.
Ladies and gentlemen, you are done for this afternoon. We'll see you tomorrow at 8:30. Again, I remind you, don't talk about this among yourselves or anyone else. Have a good night.