6.Mark Wiegert — Direct (Part 1)
87 linesMR. FALLON: State will continue, uh, with Investigator Mark Wiegert.
MARK WIEGERT, called as a witness herein, having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
COURT CLERK: Please be seated. Please state your name and spell your last name explain for the record.
MARK WIEGERT: Mark Wiegert, W-i-e-g-e-r-t.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY ATTORNEY FALLON:
MR. FALLON: How are you employed?
MARK WIEGERT: I'm an investigator with the Calumet County Sheriff's Department.
MR. FALLON: How long have you been employed by the Calumet County Sheriff's Department?
MARK WIEGERT: Approximately 14 years.
MR. FALLON: How long have you held the rank of investigator?
MARK WIEGERT: It will be about five years.
MR. FALLON: And what are, generally, the types of cases that you've been asked to investigate in your capacity at the Sheriff's Department?
MARK WIEGERT: In our Department, we do a wide variety of complaints. Anything from thefts, to burglaries, to, um, missing persons complaints, um, death investigations, up to homicide investigations.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, in this particular case, how is it that you are involved in this case?
MARK WIEGERT: Um, I happened to be working on, um -- in November. I believe it was November 3, to be exact. Um, one of our patrol deputies had taking a phone call -- or, actually, a complaint, um, about a missing person complaint. Um, it was actually, uh, Karen Halbach had called our Department to report that her daughter, uh, was missing and they haven't heard from her in several days.
After, um, patrol deputy had taken the initial information, excuse me, she had contacted me and requested my assistance, um, in attempting to locate Teresa.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, from that point on have you been involved in the case?
MARK WIEGERT: I have. Yes.
MR. FALLON: Now, there's been some, uh, discussion, uh, both by, um, Special Agent Fassbender and others, about your role as one of the lead investigators in this case. Tell us when that occurred?
MARK WIEGERT: Sure. Um, on November 5, when the vehicle was discovered, um, on the Avery Salvage Yard property uh, we were requested by Manitowoc County to lead the investigation.
At: that point when we realized how big and how massive the salvage yard was, not only the salvage yard but all the residences, uh, the outbuildings, all the property that surrounded it, um, we realized that it was a little more than our Department could handle on its own. Um, at that point we contacted the, uh, Wisconsin Department of Justice and requested their assistance.
MR. FALLON: And who responded on behalf of the Department of Justice?
MARK WIEGERT: Uh, at that time, uh, Agent Tom Fassbender, who you, um, heard earlier in the week testify, um, did respond, um, as well as several other agents from the Department. Um, at that point our Department was handed the investigation, and myself and Agent Fassbender were named the lead investigators of the com -- of the, uh -- of this case.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, let's set that aside for a moment. And in the time we have, um, this afternoon, I'd like to focus your attention ona particular part of your investigation in this case, all right? Specifically, that is with respect to, uh, your interview, uh, in context with a young woman by the name of Kayla Avery. All right.
Specifically, um, directing your attention to February 20, 2006, on that particular day, did you have, uh, an opportunity to interview Kayla Avery?
MARK WIEGERT: I.did. Um, myself, along with a female detective at our Department by the name of, uh, Wendy Baldwin, had went to, um, the Avery property, which would be the Earl and Candy Avery property, um, to interview Kayla.
Our purpose for going there was because we had some information from another person, which we had interviewed, that Kayla had information about Steve Avery. Our purpose for going there was to interview Kayla in reference to Steve Avery.
MR. FALLON: All right. And at some point during that interview did the discussion change focus from Steve Avery to Brendan Dassey?
MARK WIEGERT: Yes. Um, the interview started out about Steve Avery, and Kayla was talking about her relationship with Steve Avery. And just about at the end of that interview, Kayla, uh, out of the blue, basically, came out and told us that, uh, she had a cousin by the name of Brendan, and that Brendan was, quote, acting up lately.
So we asked Kayla what she meant by Brendan acting up lately. At that point Kayla told us that Brendan would just stare into space and start crying, basically, uncontrollably. She also told us that Brendan had -- had lost approximately, what she estimated to be, about 40 pounds.
MR. FALLON: Now, based on this information, what did you decide to do?
MARK WIEGERT: Well, after looking at that information, um, and reviewing other interviews that were done, we decided that, um, we needed to talk to Brendan again.
MR. FALLON: And did you talk to him?
MARK WIEGERT: We did. Yes.
MR. FALLON: And when did you talk to Brendan again?
MARK WIEGERT: Um, myself and Agent Fassbender interviewed Brendan on February 27 of 2006.
MR. FALLON: All right. Now, before we get into the details of that, I have a few more questions relative to Kayla Avery. On this December 20, 2006 interview of Kayla, who was present?
MARK WIEGERT: It had actually been February.
MR. FALLON: Excuse me. I'm sorry. February 20?
MARK WIEGERT: Um, Kayla's -- Kayla was present. There was -- there was two of us investigators, myself and Wendy Baldwin, Kayla, her mother, Candy, and her father, Earl.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, um, did there come a time where you reinterviewed Kayla Avery?
MARK WIEGERT: We did. Um, shortly after Brendan was arrested, actually, we interviewed Kayla again, and that would have been on March -- I believe it was March 7 of 2006.
MR. FALLON: All right. And what was the reason for, um, revisiting or reinterviewing Kayla Avery?
MARK WIEGERT: Well, I take you back a little bit, uh, shortly after, uh, Brendan was arrested, and I believe would have been on, like, February 28, we had received a call from the Mishicot School District.
Um, two of the counselors at the Mishicot School District, after hearing that Brendan had been arrested, had called and reported that they may have some information in reference to the Teresa Hal -- Teresa Halbach, uh, homicide.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, as such, did you then respond to the school to interview the counselors?
MARK WIEGERT: We did. Um, again, myself and Agent Fassbender went to the school the following day, right away in the morning, uh, where we met with, uh, two counselors, uh, Mrs. Brandt, and I believe it was a Mrs. Baumgartner.
MR. FALLON: All right. And you interviewed them?
MARK WIEGERT: We did. Yes.
MR. FALLON: After interviewing them, where did you go next?
MARK WIEGERT: Well, after getting the information, um, we thought we needed to go back and talk to Brendan ag -- excuse me -- Kayla again.
MR. FALLON: All right. Did you, in fact, go back and reinterview Kayla Avery?
MARK WIEGERT: We did. We -- Actually, after interviewing the two counselors, we made phone contact with, um, Kayla's mother and informed her that, um, we had been at the school and that we needed to talk with Kayla again. And we actually set up an appointment with Kayla's mother, and Kayla's mother, Candy, invited us, um, to her residence. Um, so waited for Kayla to come home from school, and then we went over to the Avery residence, and, uh, again, interviewed Kayla in the presence of her mother, again, and her father.
MR. FALLON: All right. Uh, was her mother present for the entire conversation?
MARK WIEGERT: Her mother was. Uh, Candy Avery was present for the entire conversation with Kayla. Um, her father, Earl, was in and out.
MR. FALLON: All right. And during that interview with Kayla Avery, did you discuss with her, um, the report that Brendan Dassey told her he had seen body parts in a fire behind Steven's garage?
MARK WIEGERT: We did. Yes.
MR. FALLON: And what did she say about that?
MARK WIEGERT: Well, Kayla came out and told us quite a few things at that point. Um, basically, she first broke down crying, and indicated to us, that, um, she had learned from her cousin, Brendan, that, um -- she stated that she had learned this in about December around the time there was a birthday party that they were both at at Kayla's house, and that Kayla -- correction -- Brendan had told Kayla that he had went and got the mail, and went over to Steven Avery's residence, and went into the residence, and observed Teresa Halbach pinned up in Steve Avery's bedroom.
She went on to tell us a couple other things. Um, she told us that Brendan had told her that after he had saw Teresa Halbach pinned up in the bedroom, that he exited the residence, and while leaving Steve Avery's residence, he heard screaming coming from Steve Avery's residence.
Kayla went on to tell us how, um -- She had mentioned Brendan being out at the fire on Halloween night, and she also told us that her and her mother had seen the fire on Halloween night.
Kayla went on to tell us how Brendan described seeing body parts later that day, or that evening, in the fire behind Steve Avery's residence.
MR. FALLON: Now, during -- during the, um, questioning of Kayla Avery earlier this week, a statement, Exhibit No. 163, was shown to her. Are you familiar with that?
MARK WIEGERT: Iam. Yes.
MR. FALLON: All right. Was that statement generated by her?
MARK WIEGERT: That's correct. Kayla wrote out that statement on her own.
MR. FALLON: All right. And is that -- was that statement written on this day, March 7, 2006?
MARK WIEGERT: Yes.
MR. FALLON: During the, um, interview, uh, at Kayla's home, did she appear confused at all? Unsure of what she was telling you?
MARK WIEGERT: No, she did not.
MR. FALLON: Was she upset?
MARK WIEGERT: Yes, she was upset.
MR. FALLON: Did it appear to you that this was something easy for her to tell you about?
MARK WIEGERT: No. Obviously, not. I mean, like I explained before, she, um -- she had broke down crying, and was visibly upset when she was telling us about this information.
MR. FALLON: All right. Now, I want to back up a little bit here. Returning, then, three weeks earlier -- two weeks earlier, excuse me, to that February 20 interview, your first encounter with Kayla Avery, at that particular point in the investigation what plans, if any, did you investigators have relative to speaking with other members of the Avery family?
MARK WIEGERT: Let me just back up a little bit. We were constantly, as investigators, have meetings about this case and where we should go with it, what we should be doing.
Um, because of the enormity of the case, we would get leads in all the time. There would be people calling in, look at this, look at that. Um, what we decided that we needed to do in order to do a thorough investigation, we needed to go back and interview everybody who had access or who lived on that property.
Um, I felt, and I -- I think I can speak for Mr. Fassbender, that I don't believe we --
MR. FREMGEN: Objection. Speaking for another person, Judge. I think the witness can only speak for himself.
THE COURT: All right. Sustained. Speak for yourself.
MARK WIEGERT: Certainly. I felt that we needed to -- In order to do a thorough investigation, we needed to go back and talk to everybody who lived on that property.
MR. FALLON: (By Attorney Fallon) All right. And so around that time was that the plan?
MARK WIEGERT: Yes. Absolutely was.
MR. FALLON: Based on the, um -- At that particular point in time could you say, from an investigative point of view, that Brendan Dassey was at all a suspect?
MARK WIEGERT: No. Uh, we didn't consider him a suspect any more than we considered anybody else at that point as a suspect. No.
MR. FALLON: All right. Now, who was the first one of the family members to be reinterviewed?
MARK WIEGERT: I can't recall exactly which one, but I can say that -- And -- And if I can back up a little bit again?
MR. FALLON: Sure.
MARK WIEGERT: Um, we not only felt the people on that -- that lived there, we thought the extended family, i.e., Kayla, and Earl, and Candy, and their children should be interviewed as well. So by my recollection, it was probably, um, Kayla, most likely.
MR. FALLON: All right. And, uh, during the course, did you, in fact, go back and reinterview a, um, um -- most, if not, all, of the immediate and extended family?
MARK WIEGERT: I can tell you everybody that lived on that property, and the extended family, as far as we knew it, such as, Earl, Candy, and their children, were reinterviewed. Yes.
MR. FALLON: All right. In terms of the decision to reinterview Brendan Dassey on February 27, um, was there any particular reason that occurred at or around that time?
MARK WIEGERT: Yes. Um, after receiving information from Kayla on the 20th of February, obviously, the loss of weight, the uncontrollable crying, are signs that we look for. I mean, it's a change in behavior. It's -- it's not normal for a 16-year-old boy to be just crying uncontrollably and just lose that type of weight. So, obviously, that's something we look for.
And, for lack of a better word, it kind of moved into the front of the line, and we needed to -- we needed to interview him and talk to him.
MR. FALLON: Now, and at that particular point did you have some suspicion as to what may be causing the weight loss and change in behavior? I mean, practically speaking?
MARK WIEGERT: Well, absolutely. I mean, at that point, um, we felt he knew more than he was telling us. And -- and we -- we do a lot of other things before we go interview people. We review prior interviews, such as the gentleman's interview that was sitting here prior to me. Marinette County's interview. I mean, review that. And we take a look at what he told them. There are things in there that didn't quite fit either.
So you take some of the things that he told the Marinette officers that just didn't seem to fit. And then his, uh, the losing weight, and the uncontrollable crying. Obviously, that, uh, points you in a direction you want to go. He's somebody you need to talk to.
MR. FALLON: All right.
MR. FALLON: Your Honor, at this particular point I think it's time to take that break.
THE COURT: I think -- Yeah. This would appear to be a good break point time. We'll adjourn for the day. Uh, ladies and gentlemen, I'll remind you, don't talk about this among yourselves or with anyone else. We'll convene tomorrow at 8:30.
(Court stands adjourned at 4:26 p.m.)