4.Mark Wiegert — Cross (Part 3)

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) Detective Wiegert, on direct you described for the benefit of -- of the State and the jury different techniques, um, that are a common time, oftentimes, employed in the interview of individuals; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. One of those you described as the superior knowledge tactic; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And one you, um, described in an effort to ultimate -- the goal being to, quote, take defensive layers off; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And I believe you used the -- the phrase, to befriend the, uh, interviewee?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. So in connection with that, uh, it wouldn't be unusual for you to say or -- say things intended to, uh, have this individual like you?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And it wouldn't be unusual to say things to have the individual believe you; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Now, again, um, going back to the 27th -- Well, before we get to the exhibit, is it fair to say that as part of this process, and I'm speaking of the 27th, that you and your partner utilized a technique by directly appealing to the emotions of Brendan Dassey?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And you did that how many times, if you know, on the 27th?

MR. EDELSTEIN: On the 27th, um, there were very distinct lies told to the defendant, were there not?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Any idea how many?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Now, as of November 15, 2005, you knew from Eisenberg, the forensic pathologist, that there were gunshot wounds to the head of Teresa Halbach; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: I believe five.

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) Prior to speaking with Brendan on the 27th -- Well, let me ask you this: Were you present when the statement was made to Brendan? And it might help you, uh -- I haven't marked this quite yet, but could you take a look at this? And, if you can, tell me if you know what it is? And mark it with whatever the next number is?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Does it also contain a transcript of the reported conversation between yourself, Fassbender, and Brendan?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And, for the record, we'll mark that as 215.

MR. EDELSTEIN: And that's, uh, something, I take it, you've had an opportunity to review before?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Directing your attention almost to the bottom of the middle paragraph, if you will, you were -- First of all, you were present throughout this entire, um, conversation we'll call it?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Does it not reflect the statement made in your presence by Agent Fassbender directed toward Brendan Dassey, quote, truthfully, I don't believe Steven intended to kill her. Do you see that? About three lines up from the large middle paragraph?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And that was said to him, wasn't it?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Is it fair to say that that was said in connection with an attempt to persuade him that, uh, it was important for him to give you information, and that you and Agent Fassbender didn't really think he did anything wrong, but that some other people might have believed that he did?

MR. EDELSTEIN: If you looked a little bit further up there --

MR. EDELSTEIN: -- do you think you -- Just take a little bit here and read that one paragraph so I can ask you my next question. I understand you've had a lot of interviews. It's hard to remember everything. Did you get a chance to look that over?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Would it be a fair characterization, then, in the early portion of the contact with Brendan that day, that there was an -- an effort on the part of yourself and your partner to convey to him that the two of you didn't necessarily think he'd done anything wrong, but there were some other people talking like he was and you didn't necessarily agree with that?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Yes. All right.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Yes. In an attempt to gain his trust?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And confidence?

MR. EDELSTEIN: He was told -- And I'm -- On page 443, about halfway down, you were present when he was told, quote, you have to tell the truth. You have no choice in that. Correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. In fact, as part of that particular discourse, Agent Fassbender went so far as to say, quote, there's nothing more I'd like to come over and give you a hug because I know you're hurting. Remember that?

MR. EDELSTEIN: The very last line in that exchange, it contains a promise, doesn't it?

MR. EDELSTEIN: So the truth of the matter is, Investigator Wiegert, that on the lst, when you went to see Brendan, that that was somewhat of a follow-up to the events of the 27th; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. And it's not just information, but it's techniques? The techniques vary from interview to interview; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, let me ask you this: Do you rec -- You watched this video with us today; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: At different times, uh, placement of yourself and Fassbender changes, doesn't it?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. That's the only reason you went over there by the couch by him?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Didn't you go over there so you could kind of cozy up to him and give him this? A pat on the back like we saw on the video?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Isn't it true that, as a technique of interrogation, that, uh, you want this subject, so to speak, to be comfortable in your presence?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And that's somewhat of a test when you move in a little bit closer to somebody, isn't it?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, in addition to his knee, you acknowledge that you patted him on the back; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Before you talked with him on the 27th, did you know anything about his IQ?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Did you know anything about his IQ --

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) Did you know anything about his IQ as of February 27 when you first spoke with him; yes or no?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Did you know anything about his memory? Whether it was good? Bad? Poor? You didn't, did you?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Would you agree with me that throughout the course of the contacts you've had with Brendan, that, oftentimes, he would be asked more than one question at a single time before he was allowed to answer?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Generally, as to March and February.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Directing your attention, um, on page 446. During the course of the contact on the 27th, and I'm looking at the very bottom paragraph --

MR. EDELSTEIN: -- you told him, in part, this will bug you 'til the day you die unless you're honest about it. Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Now, if you would, take a look at from the beginning of where you begin to speak, at the bottom of 446, over to page 447, about halfway down where you see the first entry where it says, Brendan?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. Immediately above the reference where it says, Brendan, about halfway down on 447, it is stated to him, I think you're being -- starting to be honest with us about some things right now. Correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Okay. From the bottom of 446, where you begin to speak, all the way through the middle of 447 when that statement is made, he hasn't said a single word to you, has he?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, it's fair to say that you guys -- you and Fassbender are doing a lot of talking. He's not saying much; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: No, you don't need to.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Page 448. Do you think it is a promise -- On the first entry by your name, Detective, do you think it's a promise to him when you say, we'll go to bat for you, but you have to be honest with us?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And you -- Additionally, I take it you would -- your answer would be the same, about halfway down on that page, when it is stated to him in your presence by, uh, Agent Fassbender, I promise you, I'll not let you hang out there alone, but we got to have the truth. Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. On page 451, please? You told him, it's not your fault. Remember that. Correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And up -- And he really hasn't said anything to you at that point, significant, has he?

MR. EDELSTEIN: No, that's fine.

MR. EDELSTEIN: But you acknowledge making that statement, it's not your fault. Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And then immediately thereafter, Fassbender, uh, follows up without any sort of response from Brendan, yeah, it's not your fault. Like I said, Mark and I are not going to leave you high and dry. Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, did you -- You didn't say it, Fassbender said it?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Right. And you acknowledge that prior to Brendan even responding in any way, shape, or form, or being asked for a response, it's -- your statement is immediately followed up by Fassbender reiterating that very thought, that it's not his fault. That he hasn't done anything wrong. Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay.

MR. EDELSTEIN: And further down, is it not, the -- the question is given to him, quote, what other parts did you see? Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And isn't it true that at no time, prior to that statement being made to him, did he acknowledge seeing any parts?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Begging the Court's indulgence, in order to have the witness answer my question, I would ask that he be given an opportunity to review this in order to answer that question.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Pard me?

MR. EDELSTEIN: The witness indicated he would like an opportunity to re -- review the portion of the exhibit before him, prior to that statement being made to him on page 450 -- to my client on 451, in order to answer the question. The question being: He had not, prior to you making that statement, indicated he saw any parts?

MR. EDELSTEIN: If that's the only way he can answer the question.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, if it's going to assist him to answer the question, he has the materials available, I think, uh, he can refresh his memory with that in order to answer the question.

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) Isn't it true, and I'm making reference to page 451, that Agent Fassbender, in your presence on the 27th, suggested by asking Brendan Dassey as follows: Okay. A human body. Dot, dot, dot. Isn't it true that prior to that phrase, "a human body", being uttered by Agent Fassbender, that Brendan Dassey never said anything about seeing a human body?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Nowhere does it say, prior to Fassbender making that suggestion in that form of a question, that there was a human body; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: He said he saw toes prior to that, but he did not say he saw a human body; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Do you believe it's on the inaudible part? Do you have a distinct recollection of that? Or is that just a --

MR. EDELSTEIN: convenience of testimony today?

MR. EDELSTEIN: But you don't know what's in -- contained in the inaudible part, do you?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, you're certainly not suggesting that there are significant portions of this statement that we are presently discussing that are inaudible, are you?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Going to page 453?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Keeping in mind that -- Well, let me ask you this: By the time you got to this part in your contact with Brendan, didn't it occur to you that he had some cognitive limitations?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay.

MR. EDELSTEIN: I didn't ask you what was evident to you.

MR. EDELSTEIN: I didn't ask you if you were an expert. I just asked you if you believed he had cognitive deficits?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. On page 453, you asked him, am I correct, would you say yes or no for me, Brendan? You see that?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And without giving the response, is it fair to say that he did exactly what you requested of him? I.e., say yes or no.

MR. EDELSTEIN: You asked him -- Go ahead.

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. So he did exactly what you asked him to do?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Say yes or no?

MR. EDELSTEIN: The question was: Would you say yes or no for me, Brendan? Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And that's how he answered?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Go a little further down there, Detective. Um, the statement was made to him on the 27th -- for -- for your convenience, about four lines up -- a portion of it, uh, did you help him put that body in the fire? If you did, it's okay. You acknowledge you made that statement to him?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Were you attempting to persuade him that if, in fact, he did such a thing, i.e. putting a body in a fire, that it was all right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: I'm not asking for an explanation --

MR. EDELSTEIN: -- I'm asking for an answer. My question is --

MR. EDELSTEIN: Your Honor, I'm just -- He's entitled to be rehabilitated by --

MR. EDELSTEIN: I'm sorry. Could you read it back, please?

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) All right. Were you attempting to persuade him that what he did was, as you put it, okay?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. Now, as a trained investigator with 14 is it? 15? I can't --

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. Fourteen years. You know that's not true; right? Somebody puts a body in a fire, it's not okay?

MR. EDELSTEIN: So you acknowledge that that -- you called it deception, I call it a lie. We call it whatever we want. But it's not true, is it?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And the statement that you made to him was -- I guess you would characterize it as a deception?

MR. EDELSTEIN: I -- I certainly will.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Thank you. Detective Wiegert, uh, as a result of you being lead investigator, along with Agent Fassbender, in this case, you've had an opportunity to be present throughout the proceedings; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. So you've had the benefit of being able to hear what all the other witness of this -- witnesses have said prior to your opportunity to testify?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And you heard Nick Stahlke testify; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. He's our blood spatter man?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Had -- Had -- Prior to this case, had you ever been involved in any cases that, uh, might have utilized blood -- blood spatter evidence?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Brendan was asked, was he not, on the 27th -- And I'm making reference at 459?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. About the middle of the page. Question: Did he say anything about shooting her? You asked him that; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And you knew by the time you conducted this interview, interrogation, whatever you want to call it, that there was evidence of a gunshot wound to Teresa Halbach; isn't that true?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Is it fair to say that you did not follow up with that particular question, um, and I'm making reference to the shooting her question, anytime soon following the time it was first proposed to him during the course of this interview?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, let me -- That was poorly phrased, Your Honor. Let me try it a different way.

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) You knew, based upon your role as one of the co-lead investigators, there was evidence of a gunshot wound on that day when you did the interview?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. Um, but if you would, take a look at 459, then?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Just on that page alone, is it correct that there are five questions given to him after your question to him, quote, did he say anything about shooting her?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. None of them are a follow-up as to having anything to do with a shooting; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Page 463, please?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. Apparently there's no response; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And then the next entry? Again, it's you speaking to Brendan. No. As in a question. No? Say yes or no. Is that what it says? And is that what you said to him?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And -- and, again, he did exactly what you told him to do, and that is say yes or no, as his next response?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, it really wasn't a question. It was a command, wasn't it? Say yes or no. That's not a question, is it?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Pard me?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, you're telling him to do something, are you not?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And he does, does he not?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. On page 463 --

MR. EDELSTEIN: Can you drop down a little bit?

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) The question was put to him, did he say where he cut himself? And Agent Fassbender's making reference to Steven Avery; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And then there's no response; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Fassbender then suggests --

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And then Fassbender follows up immediately with -- on the knife that he used to kill her, yes or no. Correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. The next entry being, yeah?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Do you know whether or not, and can you tell this jury whether or not, the response, yeah, from Brendan was in answer to the Fassbender inquiry, did he say he cut himself? Or whether it was a response to the statement Fassbender makes, on the knife that he used to kill her, yes or no?

MR. EDELSTEIN: But that's your interpretation of the transcript where there's no answer by Brendan; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Directing your attention to page 464, please?

MR. EDELSTEIN: About three-quarters of the way down?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Do you see where the question is asked of him, did he say he had a gun with dot, dot, dot?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Is it correct that there are actually three questions asked of him before he's even given an opportunity to respond?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Not in that one sentence, in the next -- in the next three sentences? The next three entries? Before there's any response? And there is no blank space where you're anticipating a response; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. But you don't know what -- whether there was a pause?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. It's not an uncommon technique to pepper an individual with questions? And that -- by that I mean, ask them in rapid succession by the various investigators involved?

MR. EDELSTEIN: On page 466?

MR. EDELSTEIN: You ask the question, did he threaten you? Correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And there is a response irregardless of what it is; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: That little exchange, if we confine that to the threats in this particular interview, is it fair to say that the subject is changed by you during the discussion of this issue of threats, and you simply say, go back to the clothes. And that occurs within a matter of three or four questions?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Well, in regard to that, you never asked him, um -- The question was asked of him, what did he say? Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Um, nobody asked him when that was said; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Nobody asked him where it was said; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Were you not interested in knowing that if -- if someone has, in fact, threatened somebody, that it would be important to know when that statement was made?

MR. EDELSTEIN: I'm talking about this interview.

MR. EDELSTEIN: I'm talking about the interview as a whole.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Is it fair to say that there was not a effort to fully develop that as information, um, at this point in the interview of the 27th?

MR. EDELSTEIN: You were more interested in going back to other things that might be more directly related to the disappearance and death of Teresa; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. Well, is that, in fact, the reason that you shifted back to --

MR. EDELSTEIN: Your Honor, if I could have just a -- a minute? I may move onto the, uh, March 1 -- I guess I'm not quite ready to get to March 1, but we're close.

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) Later in the day on the 27th, I think you said on direct, because there was problems with -- or what you perceived to be problems with the audiotape of the interview at the school, you took him down to, uh, Two Rivers Police Department; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Can you identify what's been marked as 214, please?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. Um, this is what you use when you have a criminal suspect, don't you?

MR. EDELSTEIN: If you had a criminal suspect at a police department, and you're going to question him, are you telling us you're not going to read him this Miranda warning?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay.

MR. EDELSTEIN: And the district attorney is your legal adviser; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Your Honor, I move, uh, 214, please, into --

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) When you went over there to Two Rivers, your intention was pretty much to try to memorialize the type of things that you discussed up at the school?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Without going into the tedi -- the tedium of, um, question and answers, uh, that may have -- or questions that may have been asked of Brendan at that interview, is it fair to say that it was you, Fassbender, and Brendan?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And is it also fair to say that some of the same techniques that were employed earlier at, uh, the high school, were utilized, as well, at Two Rivers?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And that would include lies?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And that would include attempts to appeal to his emotions?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And it would include attempts to have him give responses based upon leading questions containing facts you believed to be true?

MR. EDELSTEIN: You can't tell us how many --

MR. EDELSTEIN: -- with -- without counting them up, I guess.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Now, at the conclusion of that, is it fair to say that you were still of the opinion that Brendan had not been totally honest with you?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And I believe you, during the course of that conversation, um, made him understand from time to time that you didn't think he was telling you everything there was to tell?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Ultimately, he, and his mom, and, I believe, uh, was it a brother -- you made arrangements -- you and Fassbender made some arrangements for them to stay up at Fox Hills?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And that's a resort in Mishicot?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And I believe your testimony was you wanted him to stay up there for, um, con -- You were concerned about his welfare?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. And what were your two reasons?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And isn't it true, Investigator Wiegen, (sic) that another reason was that you were attempting to befriend him and his family?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Wasn't it true that another reason you wanted him up there was to isolate him?

MR. EDELSTEIN: The last contact you have with investigators on the 27th was in -- initiated at approximately 10:50 p.m. at night; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And what time was the first contact at the school? I think you said about 12:30?

MR. EDELSTEIN: When you interviewed Brendan on the lst, where did that take place?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Do you know how many times either you or Agent Fassbender, during the course of the interview on March 1, the video one that we all watched here today, suggested to Brendan or told Brendan that he was a liar?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Do you know how many times, after he was told that he was a liar, that he changed his answer in response to that sort of accusation?

MR. EDELSTEIN: But you acknowledge he did?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, was he not told --

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) Detective, let me hand you what's been marked for identification as 216. Do you recognize that as a transcript of the video interview that you and Agent Fassbender had with Brendan on the lst?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Same one that we saw earlier; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Yes.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, if you would -- Directing your attention to page 540 --

MR. EDELSTEIN: -- do you agree that that's, uh, pretty early in the contact?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Brendan, on the lst, in your mind and the mind of Fassbender, is, in fact, a suspect, isn't he? When you conduct this interview, he is a suspect in your mind; yes or no?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Is that why, on page 540, it was said to him by Fassbender in your presence, I want to assure you that Mark and I are both in your corner. We're on your side?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Take a look at that middle paragraph. Would it -- Is it a fair characterization and interpretation of what Fassbender says that he is encouraging Brendan to say things that might make Brendan look a little bad in order for him to be believed?

MR. EDELSTEIN: We've already had an opportunity to see it. What I'm asking you, is it a fair characterization that the intent of that is to have him say things which implicate himself, and only by doing so would then you and Fassbender believe him?

MR. EDELSTEIN: But it was trick -- It was, in fact, said to him that, and I'm about halfway in the middle of that particular statement to him, even if those statements are against your own interest, you know what I mean, that -- then that makes you might -- it might make you look a little bad, or make you look like you were more involved than you want to be. Uh, it's hard to do, but it's good from the vantage point to say, hey, there's no doubt you're telling the truth.

MR. EDELSTEIN: And isn't the purpose of -- But doesn't that encourage him to say something irregardless of whether it's true or not?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Because someone in a position of authority is telling him that, if you say something that doesn't help you, then we might believe you.

MR. EDELSTEIN: On that same page, he was encouraged once again, quote, okay, you don't have to worry about things. Any idea how many times he was told that during the course of that interview?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Would it surprise you if I were to suggest that it was in excess of 75 times during the course of the interview on the lst that either you or Fassbender, in one form or another, said something to him suggesting, or directly stating to him, that he was a liar?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, directing your attention to page 587?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Five eighty-seven.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. About middle way down?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Fassbender: It's extremely, extremely important you tell us this for us to believe you. That statement was made to Brendan; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: He didn't respond. And you immediately said, come on, Brendan, what else? Right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. Immediately before Fassbender makes the statement how extremely important it is, you're questioning him about her head; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: All right. You accused him, during the course of this interview, of shooting Teresa; correct?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, the truth of the matter is, you don't know if it's right and you don't know if it's wrong, do you?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Correct.

MR. EDELSTEIN: Let me stop you there. You know he was there because he told you that; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Well, these are the bleached jeans, Exhibit 58; right?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Okay. You got them out of his house?

MR. EDELSTEIN: He told you they were there?

MR. EDELSTEIN: He willingly gave them to you?

MR. EDELSTEIN: And he told you that he got bleach on there because he cleaned up some stuff, at Steve's request, in the garage?

MR. EDELSTEIN: Your Honor, I -- I know it's almost 4:30. I guess I would just have -- I could wrap up for today just real quickly.

MR. EDELSTEIN: By 4:30.

MR. EDELSTEIN: (By Attorney Edelstein) These jeans, the cuffs, the bullets, the shells, the shovels, the seat, everything that the Government's paraded in here, other than these, which contain what are believed to be bleach spots, which Brendan told you about, none of these items have fingerprints, DNA, or any other scientific evidence connecting Brendan Dassey to the death of Teresa Halbach; yes or no?

MR. EDELSTEIN: No other questions for today, Your Honor.

MR. EDELSTEIN: I doubt it.

MR. EDELSTEIN: I am, Your Honor. I -- I'll have an opportunity to review tonight, and I should be able to, hopefully, not take as long tomorrow.