4.Curtis Drumm — Direct/Cross
162 linesMR. KRATZ: State would call Curt Drumm, your Honor.
COURT CLERK: Raise your right hand.
CURTIS DRUMM, called as a witness herein, having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
COURT CLERK: Please be seated. Please state your name and spell your last name for the record.
CURTIS DRUMM: Curtis W. Drumm, D-r-u-m-m.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY ATTORNEY KRATZ:
MR. KRATZ: Mr. Drumm, if you could sit back just a little bit, you are a little loud. Tell the jury, please, where are you from?
CURTIS DRUMM: I live in Manitowoc.
MR. KRATZ: And were you asked, on the 4th of November, of 2005, to assist law enforcement officers in search efforts for Teresa Halbach?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes, I was.
MR. KRATZ: And what were you asked to help with?
CURTIS DRUMM: At that point I didn't know the name or anything else, just that I was asked to help search for a missing person.
MR. KRATZ: Sometime on the 4th, then, of November, Mr. Drumm, did you assist law enforcement?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes, we went up that afternoon for about two and a half hours.
MR. KRATZ: You probably might want to tell the jury what you mean by we went up?
CURTIS DRUMM: I'm sorry, we -- they had called and asked if we had an aircraft available. I operate the pilot services at the Manitowoc airport. And our run was called the fix base operator. We rent airplanes, provide flight instruction, things like that.
The Sheriff's Department called and noted that they had a missing person and would we have an airplane and pilot available to go up and search several locations that they thought she might have been at. And I said, yes, and we set up a time. They came out in the afternoon.
We went up for about two and a half hours starting around 1:30, 2:00 and flew until sometime around 5:00. Went to two different locations in the Manitowoc County area. And then followed a path that took us up toward Green Bay and then back down toward this area here where the home was and then back over to the Manitowoc area.
MR. KRATZ: One of the first witnesses that answered all my questions before I even asked them, so.
CURTIS DRUMM: I'm sorry, I didn't know what order you wanted it.
MR. KRATZ: Trust me, it's pleasant this way, Mr. Drumm. I'm going to have to go back, though. The investigators that you went up with, did those include Sheriff Jerry Pagel from the Calumet County Sheriff's Department, as well as Investigator Wendy Baldwin from the Sheriff's Department?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes, sir.
MR. KRATZ: Were you told where to fly; in other words, were you told what locations they were interested in?
CURTIS DRUMM: They gave me, I think some latitude longitudes, which I programmed into a GPS. And, of course, I knew nothing of the nature of the investigation. They just told me to go there, that they were looking for a possible car or a person. The first location was relatively near the airport. Am I getting ahead of myself?
MR. KRATZ: No, you are doing great. Why don't you tell us that first location -- By the way, do you know whose home, or whose residence, or where that was located?
CURTIS DRUMM: They did not tell me, no. It was the vicinity of Highway 310 and Q I believe, about a mile and a half from the airport. We circled over that property and a radius of a couple miles around that area.
MR. KRATZ: Let me stop you there, Mr. Drumm. The residence around Highway 310 and Q, was that the first location that they instructed you to look at?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes, sir.
MR. KRATZ: Are you familiar, Mr. Drumm, with the Avery Auto Salvage property?
CURTIS DRUMM: I was not until following, everything had happened.
MR. KRATZ: But are you now, familiar?
CURTIS DRUMM: Oh, yes, sir.
MR. KRATZ: And was that the first property that they asked you to go search around?
CURTIS DRUMM: No, that was the second.
MR. KRATZ: All right. So Avery's wasn't even the first place that they asked you to look?
CURTIS DRUMM: No, sir.
MR. KRATZ: All right. After that first residence, then you were asked to search a second property; is that right?
CURTIS DRUMM: That's affirmative. That ended up being the Avery property. We followed roads. Again, they weren't sure why she was missing, so we followed roads and the smaller county highways to see if she had maybe gone off the road or into the ditch or had an accident that wasn't reported or otherwise found. Eventually worked our way up to what's the Avery property.
MR. KRATZ: When you say that we were searching, what's all included in an aerial search or a search with an airplane?
CURTIS DRUMM: You know, they were the investigators, so they knew what they were looking for. As a pilot, I'm more used to looking at things from the air, so they gave me a description of the vehicle we were looking for, the color and the make and model.
And we tried to see if there was any place where that car might have been in a ditch, or an area where it may have been involved in an accident, or if it had been hidden some place, or behind a garage or in front of some trees, or whatever.
From above, you have got a lot better perspective of areas, being able to look down through the trees and through different areas. So we tried to find the car.
MR. KRATZ: Mr. Drumm, then, not just residences, but you also searched roadways and ditches.
CURTIS DRUMM: Roadways, ditches, area farms, behind barns, any place that, you know, she may have gone either on purpose or otherwise. We just tried to identify any places we might assist in finding the car.
MR. KRATZ: There's an exhibit in front of you, Exhibit No. 25. I'm going to have the jury look at this at the same time you are. Why don't you tell us what this is, what are we looking at?
CURTIS DRUMM: Looks like the salvage yard.
MR. KRATZ: And, again, does Exhibit 25, at least from an aerial view, which are views that you are familiar with, does this look the same or similar as it did on or about the 4th of November, of 2005?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes, it does. Yeah, there was several adjacent gravel pits to it, forest areas, farm areas. This appears to be the private property we looked at.
MR. KRATZ: Okay. Now, I assume, Mr. Drumm, that as we zoom in a little bit on this photograph, is it fair that it would be difficult to pick out a specific car in that location?
CURTIS DRUMM: We tried to fly over different aisles and the size of the yard was -- was so expansive and so many vehicles there, it was difficult really to pick out anything of any detail. We were at about 500 feet, which is the FAA minimum for a flight over unpopulated areas. But even from 500 feet, it's tough to pick out a specific car.
MR. KRATZ: All right. Did you find any vehicle that looked like a blue, or teal, or greenish Toyota RAV4.
CURTIS DRUMM: Not that I'm aware of. If the investigators saw something, they didn't tell me.
MR. KRATZ: After the Avery property was searched, you said that you went someplace else, could you describe that.
CURTIS DRUMM: They had indicated that she might have had some friends up in Green Bay that she might have been meeting with. And we followed primarily the county roads east of I-43, because that's where she would have been coming from, from this, if this had been her last stop. And worked our way up toward Green Bay, again, looking to see if there was anything in ditches or side roads or anything.
I questioned why, they said, well, maybe she had an accident, or something hadn't been reported, or was at the side of the road. So we followed the roads all the way up, almost to Green Bay, then turned around and followed the roads on the west side back toward her residence. And, again, searching all the side roads and looking for anything that might have been out of the ordinary.
MR. KRATZ: So you were told that the area on or adjacent to the Halbach, that is, the Teresa Halbach residence was also searched; is that right?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes, we spent a fair amount of time in that vicinity, again, looking to see if the car was around, if we could find anything that might help them find the girl.
MR. KRATZ: Was there also another property; that is, another residence in Calumet County that you were asked to search around? Do you remember?
CURTIS DRUMM: We may have gone -- They may have -- We flew over a lot of areas. Basically, I just flew the airplane and the investigators asked me to go left or go right, to different areas. I didn't question where exactly they were looking, but we spent a fair amount of time in this area looking -- looking at different areas, just points of interest of theirs.
MR. KRATZ: And to get right to the question, Mr. Drumm, at least based upon what the investigators told you, was the Avery salvage property the focal point, or the only place that you were looking for Teresa's car?
CURTIS DRUMM: No. We spent substantial time looking at other locations.
MR. KRATZ: I would move the admission of Exhibit 25. That's all the questions I have.
MR. STRANG: No objection.
THE COURT: Very well. The exhibit is admitted. Mr. Strang.
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY ATTORNEY STRANG:
MR. STRANG: Good afternoon, Mr. Drumm.
CURTIS DRUMM: Hi.
MR. STRANG: Do you know now what the first place was that you flew over near the intersection of 310 and Q?
CURTIS DRUMM: They mentioned a name and I don't really recall. They just said that these were locations where she had appointments.
MR. STRANG: Okay. There was a residence?
CURTIS DRUMM: There was a residence and several outbuildings, several trees.
MR. STRANG: Rural sort of residences?
CURTIS DRUMM: Pardon me?
MR. STRANG: Rural sort of residences?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes.
MR. STRANG: Okay. So you went there, then you flew essentially north to the Mishicot area, to the Avery property?
CURTIS DRUMM: Correct.
MR. STRANG: From there, continued north to the Green Bay area?
CURTIS DRUMM: Correct. We didn't do the city of Green Bay, we got to the southern outskirts.
MR. STRANG: Following what, 42 or 57?
CURTIS DRUMM: We basically followed the east side of I-43.
MR. STRANG: Okay. Back down along the lakeshore?
CURTIS DRUMM: No. We came back down on the west side of I-43 back toward --
MR. STRANG: Toward Chilton.
CURTIS DRUMM: -- toward Chilton.
MR. STRANG: Past Hilbert, St. John?
CURTIS DRUMM: Again, kind of zigzagged around from an airplane at 500 to a thousand feet, clear day, you have pretty good visibility.
MR. STRANG: This was on November 4?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes, correct.
MR. STRANG: The plane wasn't equipped with aerial photography equipment?
CURTIS DRUMM: No, sir.
MR. STRANG: And, obviously, you were piloting the plane?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes.
MR. STRANG: So, someone else in the plane was taking photos?
CURTIS DRUMM: I believe one of the investigators was taking pictures.
MR. STRANG: I mean, not you?
CURTIS DRUMM: No.
MR. STRANG: And were these just sort of regular snapshot kind of cameras out the window as you banked?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes.
MR. STRANG: Any videotaping going on on November 4th?
CURTIS DRUMM: I'm sorry, I don't recall that.
MR. STRANG: Fair enough.
CURTIS DRUMM: I was looking out the front window.
MR. STRANG: I understood that. And, then, as you flew back from Chilton, Hilbert, and the area north of here, back to Manitowoc; was it back to the Avery Auto Salvage, or back to the airport?
CURTIS DRUMM: Back to the airport.
MR. STRANG: Okay. Now, the photograph that we have up here is Exhibit 25. As it is set up now, that's a view from substantially above 500 feet above ground level, true?
CURTIS DRUMM: From that perspective we would have been -- that looks like higher than 500 feet.
MR. STRANG: Fifteen hundred feet above ground level, probably something like that?
CURTIS DRUMM: Depends on the angle of the lens you use, that could have been much lower, if you use a wide enough lens and made it look like that.
MR. STRANG: I'm --
CURTIS DRUMM: It's hard to tell.
MR. STRANG: I'm just -- I'm just looking at the size of the buildings and the size of cars. You -- you've been flying for how long?
CURTIS DRUMM: Fifteen, twenty years.
MR. STRANG: Okay. Familiar with something called pattern altitude?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes.
MR. STRANG: Ordinarily that's a thousand feet above ground level?
CURTIS DRUMM: Correct.
MR. STRANG: Okay. Pattern meaning when you are in a pattern over the airport?
CURTIS DRUMM: Right.
MR. STRANG: You have done a lot of flying in the pattern, as they say, at a thousand feet above ground level?
CURTIS DRUMM: Correct.
MR. STRANG: You are familiar with the general view of terrain at approximately that altitude?
CURTIS DRUMM: Correct.
MR. STRANG: This looks a little bit higher than that?
CURTIS DRUMM: If you were at a thousand looking with the naked eye, that -- that's -- that's higher.
MR. STRANG: Okay.
MR. STRANG: Now, maybe with Mr. Kratz's help, we can zoom in just a little bit.
MR. KRATZ: Where would you like me to zoom in?
MR. STRANG: Let's -- Let's go up to the pond. Can we go to -- a little further or do we lose resolution? Okay. Let's work with that.
MR. STRANG: (By Attorney Strang)~ Just give us a perspective of about 500 feet above ground level?
CURTIS DRUMM: That's approximately 500.
MR. STRANG: Okay. Which is considered the minimum safe altitude for flying over sparsely populated areas.
CURTIS DRUMM: Correct.
MR. STRANG: Now, if -- if -- if -- I realize the window is in the photograph, but this area here, can you see me and see it?
CURTIS DRUMM: Yes.
MR. STRANG: Why don't you tell our jurors what you recall this area as being, if you do?
CURTIS DRUMM: I don't exactly recall if that's a gravel pit area. There were a lot of gravel pit areas, either active or abandoned. I don't recall what that area was.
MR. STRANG: Just for orientation, though, you recall this as being south; that is, the right edge of this photo as being south?
CURTIS DRUMM: I believe so.
MR. STRANG: Okay. What you do remember is there were a lot of gravel pits around the Avery Auto Salvage?
CURTIS DRUMM: That's correct.
MR. STRANG: Or quarries?
CURTIS DRUMM: Correct.
MR. STRANG: Okay. And whether that's one of them or not, you just don't remember?
CURTIS DRUMM: Again, I don't know what I was looking for, so, other than a car.
MR. STRANG: You went up again on November 5 -- or no, on Saturday, November 5, or no?
CURTIS DRUMM: Not with law enforcement.
MR. STRANG: Not with law enforcement?
CURTIS DRUMM: No, I made other flights, subsequent, once it became apparent what was going on, but not with any law enforcement.
MR. STRANG: With whom did you make other flights over the Avery Auto Salvage property?
CURTIS DRUMM: I don't recall.
MR. STRANG: But, I mean, just as a matter of interest while the search for Teresa Halbach was going on?
CURTIS DRUMM: The area north of the airport, in that vicinity, is a regular practice area we use with students. It's off the airways. It's not near the airport. It's -- It's an area we use for practicing flying over unpopulated areas.
MR. STRANG: Okay.
CURTIS DRUMM: So that wouldn't be in the path of going to some place on a training flight.
MR. STRANG: And, in other words, the flights you did later, to the extent they took you over the Avery Auto Salvage, were unrelated to the search for Teresa Halbach?
CURTIS DRUMM: Right, they had nothing to do with it.
MR. STRANG: How much time did you spend in the general vicinity of the Avery Auto Salvage Yard?
CURTIS DRUMM: Oh, I would say maybe 15 minutes, 20 minutes.
MR. STRANG: How much time, roughly, over the first residence, Highway 310 and Highway Q?
CURTIS DRUMM: Five or ten.
MR. STRANG: And mostly, then, transit time, other than some time circling over Hilbert, St. Johns, that area?
CURTIS DRUMM: Correct. And when we did our transit, they weren't straight lines necessarily, we flew around again surveying the side roads trying to see if we could see anything.
MR. STRANG: That's all I have. Oh, I'm sorry, just a moment. That's it. Thank you.
THE COURT: Mr. Kratz, any redirect?
MR. KRATZ: No, Judge. Thank you.
THE COURT: Very well, the witness is excused.
MR. KRATZ: Steve Schmitz, please.